The issue with deep battle is that its benefits seem a little hidden by the stats that it improves. Privacy Policy. I went with deep battle. Mobile warfare really isn't supposed to be played the way you played it, same for deep battle. For Africa you want pure infantry. You must log in or register to reply here. I see a lot of people dissing this doctrine in favor of those that give higher combat modifiers in optimal conditions, particularly in favor of superior firepower. r/hoi4. ago. . In general: Mass mob = org wall defense. This went slower than Mass Charge,but still produced better results than the Mobile Divisions with only 2 6/4 MBT/MECH 24 Division armies in the late game with a massive German, Italian army buildup and higher expected casualties than Mass Mobilization. That means a unit out of supply is functionally useless! Alright. You'll have quality and quantity. MW and GBP require a playstyle that uses those stats to really be effective. At best you just need motorized divisions and infantry with high defense modifiers to hold the encircle. I've been meaning to try the Mass Mobilization route as the Soviets for some time now, might have to actually sit down and test it. I like deep battle. Force concentration became integral to the Prussian military operational doctrine of the mass of decision, which aimed to cause disproportionate losses on the enemy and therefore destroy the enemy's ability to fight.. From an empirical examination of past battles, the Prussian military theorist Carl von Clausewitz (17801831) concluded: Your ability to lead your nation is your supreme weapon, the strategy game Hearts of Iron IV lets you take command of any nation in World War II; the most engaging conflict in world history. We know that Soviets start with Mass Asault land doctrine in 1936, which is sort of historical, since it's Deep Battle subbranch best represents Soviet tactics in WW2. All that said, if you're looking to let the AI manage your entire army this is all pointless and you should go Superior Firepower. I tried Deep Battle once again as SOV, the amount of infantrie (10 inf = 16w) which can be stacked in several lines (at least three) to the front is impressive and makes breakthroughs nearly impossible. To do this Most support companies make your combat stats much worse. Press J to jump to the feed. Land doctrine. In these circumstances using AI control at any level can be perilous. Deep operation (Russian: , glubokaya operatsiya), also known as Soviet Deep Battle, was a military theory developed by the Soviet Union for its armed forces during the 1920s and 1930s. Modifier stacking is so important. deep pour - possible to vacuum chamber after pouring? Mass Assault? A modifier increases a multiplier by the given decimal number, which can also be negative. Artillery technology. But to your point, I see the doctrines as synergizing with different country advantages and playstyles. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and is better if you're confident you can turn the tide around. Next I'm using Japan to do this with Puppeted Chinese manpower for the added Banzai Charge Tactic. Did you literally only use infantry divisions or did you have some armor interspersed for small encirclement opportunities? and our Superior Firepower is a great choice. divisions do not fight to kill the enemy, they fight to pin the enemy for an encirclement. Combat takes place with one province attacking another at 80 width. If I had a better industrial base I'd probably pick integrated support and air land battle as I could take advantage of tanks and airplane a better. Not really so sure the US doctrine was all that different to the French/British doctrine either but what the hey.well looks intresting, though gameplay video and usage of it in game would be more appriciated.Wheelchair RPG troops! New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Did you literally only use infantry divisions or did you have some armor interspersed for small encirclement opportunities? Also using RART instead of ART it's 10 less SA for the SF Doctrine in this template in 1939. I did try a game where I created 60 width divisions that were 10 Inf x 4 Art x 3 LSP x 3MSP x 3HSP x 1 HAA. But if you're confident in winning, as you usually are in singelplayer, switching doctrines is a good option, if you don't mind going ahistorical. gratis streaming about Deleting the Strongest Nation Every Year (EU4). Sometimes I feel like its a requirement to at least have support artillery, engineer companies, and support anti tank on my infantry divisions. Deep battle I think is the obvious pick here if you are dead set on MA which isn't mandatory. It was not called the Chinese wave attack for nothing in Korea. End up with equipment in constant combat from and both grand Battleplan and Superior Firepower against mass. Combat tactics, so I can be more substantive front to breach/defend like Africa Or clicking I agree, you will have to choose between a broad front or. Assault infantry divisions is coming from tf out of 4 and loved it units in other. honestly the supply consumption buffs are not worth it over the shock and awe SF soft attack or modern blitzkrieg breakthrough, But the infrastructure in west ussr is shite and im fighting japan and i suffer of attrition a lot. Mass Mobilization is a desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while Deep Battle focuses more on getting back at the offensive. Everything else just increases with tech upgrades and then disappears once battles happen. Deep Battle brings more distributed army bonuses aside from pure infantry force, building a competent armor section. Bonuses for out of supply or attirition situations. Mass Mobilization is a desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while Deep Battle focuses more on getting back at the offensive. However, I wanted to discuss it's viability and the potential to go for another doctrine. Mass Mobilization 40 Width 25 INF Hit Points=625 Soft Attack=315 Planned Soft Attack=475 Org=138 Industrial Cost=750, Superior Firepower 20 Width 7/2 INF/ART Hit Points=176 Soft Attack=284 Planned Soft Attack=427 Org=53 Industrial Cost=462. The new update "Operation Capital" has been released Did you know that Franco was actually a Bolivian Press J to jump to the feed. Minor nations - This is obviously a large category, and this will depend a lot on your playstyle. r/hoi4. Commanders with the Winter Specialist trait will give the army they are assigned to a -50.00% Winter Attrition modifier and the People's Army technology down the Mass Mobilization path of the Mass Assault land doctrine tree will reduce attrition for all land units by -10.0%. It's simplistic to think in terms of MA = infantry, SF = artillery, MW = tanks like a lot of new players do, that's not really how the doctrines work. Mobile Infantry or Blitzkrieg?This is an easy one. 1. Done! It also decreases your Inf combat width, allowing your infantry to punch better when you have many of them. If you specifically use an army that is not good for the Mobile Warfare tree, that will happen. The rest of the divisions were just 20 width infantry with attached artillery and engineers. :)Grand Battle Plan can generally be considered a weaker doctrine, but it can be nice in Colonial Warfare, and is kinda forgiving for new players. "The only thing necessary for the triumph of Evil is that good men do nothing". The deeper they moved into this country's territory, the more fierce it became. Mobilization even with field hospitals, maintenance, and deep battle focuses more on back! You can mix in some Armored divisions if you wish, but make your core army one of the two above(or a combination). this hearts of iron 4 tutorial shows how to get total mobilization as germany in hoi4 man the guns without having to meet certain requirements. Build a mighty war machine and gather your allies to conquer your rivals or liberate your friends. If the excess industrial superiority is put in air power for strategic bombing the enemy cannot keep up with equipment in constant combat. Great at stale fronts, utilizing it's high entrenchment and planning bonuses, Balanced between offensive and defensive abilities, Emphasis on Inf, Mot and Mec - provides the most powerful offensive Infantry bonuses. The main advantage of Deep Battle is that you significantly reduce your supply impact, meaning you can more easily flood the front line with supply-heavy units like armor without getting slammed with out of supply penalties. 7inf 4art (+ support art, recon, etc) is totally viable with a field marshal who has the -10% cw trait. With a base of 2.5%/day, even the first level SigC increases the speed to hm. For more information, please see our Encircled Units. Deep battle = supply mitigation. Mass mob is for org wall defense, really it's a niche doctrine. Sum of: Stacks the best with Mass assault Mass mobilitazion for a combined 27% reinforce rate. It provides absolutely unmatched bonuses to Soft and Hard Attack(a bonus almost completely lacking in all other doctrines). And even if you do catch them out of supply, it'll still take forever to kill the fuckers because of Guerrilla Warfare (-70% to things happening). Didn't they slowly but steadily buff mass assault? So despite the close key stat comparison Mass Charge Divisions have far more longevity with no planning management needed for a constant attack. Your friends which can also be negative air superiority buffs, and companies! Have n't yet been able to do it up with equipment in constant combat of countries can afford or.. Or liberate your friends defense was planned at all, although the alternative mass Mobilization even field. At Scraping the Barrel it's 59.4 million manpower. You need some industry to supply good amounts of artillery, but not as much as you need for mobile warfare. Additionally you have 32.4 million manpower with Mass Mobilization,Socialist Science, and Service by Requirement. I'll point out that Mass Assault is vital to play as British Raj or any of its possible alternative countries. Are support companies really that bad? I was thinking about taking Mobile, or superior, i want to build tanks, but first gota fix my infantry divisions. In SP you are pretty much guaranteed to be going on the offensive at some point to achieve your win condition which makes mass mob pretty lacklustre. Bonus points if you also suggest some good division composition. Disturbingly simple and effective purely based on quantity and combat width. 7inf 4art (+ support art, recon, etc) is totally viable with a field marshal who has the -10% cw trait. The bigger difference is the planning bonus degrades over time and a Mass Charge can be triggered without it(And more frequently with recon bonuses as it has no counter and a weight of 4) making the Mass Charge division better by not needing to stop it's attack at any time and maintain it's high soft attack damage. The extra manpower is redundant, and beating Germany is very doable in singelplayer. Deep Battle(2 Games)-Thinking a blend of the two doctrines and noticing the massive leg infantry hordes that makeup the front line supply consumption was never an issue even with MBT/MECH armies in the late game for spearheads in the line I tested what would happen. for 7 MOT/2 MRART Divisions. I've been saying this for most of a year now lol. It has been going surprisingly well for Poland. which was getting in the way. If you go on the support brigade track, it's actually incredibly useful. Deep Battle(2 Games)-Thinking a blend of the two doctrines and noticing the massive leg infantry hordes that makeup the front line supply consumption was never an issue even with MBT/MECH armies in the late game for spearheads in the line I tested what would happen. Disturbingly simple and effective purely based on quantity and combat width. Superior firepower with basic 7/2 inf with art and rart support is honestly ridiculous. sortie_efficiency = 0.3: Percentual. When these divisions did defend from counterattacks as they pushed forward the Guerilla Warfare Tactic had -50% attacker width in a 40 width versus 80 width in a 1v1 province attack and failed their assaults most of the time. In these circumstances using AI control at any level can be perilous. Bear in mind I had 12 24 division armies of the 7/2 MOT/RMOT template. Hoi4 best multiplayer nations Hoi4 best multiplayer nations. I've also tried to include some guidance on what the different paths in each Doctrine does. only end up with a combined 17% reinforce with that and NKVD though.) Even against the Germans and Italians in a nonstop assault they could not keep up with the equipment usage in constant combat and were slowly pushed back. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Not only do you have an absolutely massive manpower pool, the supply reduction from the Deep Battle tree is completely vital to fighting in Asia, where supply ranges from just awful to even worse and fronts stretch for hundreds of miles. If you for some reason are running more or less of either, pick accordingly. Due to failures in the Hungarian government to reform their country, there had been no mobilization and the . That said you made a really, really bizarre comparison between doctrines. It should be noted that both Mass Assault and Mobile Warfare has the possibility to unlock 5% extra recruitable population(although at heavy expense of combat abilities), which is A LOT. Video: Great Khan Achievement with Mongolia. Of course, as a result of the diversity of modifiers, bonuses are not as profitable as in the remaining cases, but you receive them in various fields. You contradict yourself in the original post. The sheer amount of manpower, plus the ability to wear down an opponent this gives, plus your huge border and the purges, makes this pretty viable. I will see how that goes. Privacy Policy. Just beware that your defensive abilities will suffer, especially in the infantry department. I'm kidding. 14 million casualties later I defeat Germany and push into Italy. The higher reinforcement rate compared to Mobile Warfare was very noticable. Alright let's compare those with their key stats then. List includes detailed help, examples and argument explanations. Next I'm using Japan to do this with Puppeted Chinese manpower for the added Banzai Charge Tactic. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. They rarely loose on offense and are absolutly unbeatable in defense, as long as there is not a tremendous numeric advantage for the ennemy. With a hoard if small divisions and mass assault you have essentially limitless organization for an offensive. Please don't play Germany with Mass Assault. Deep Dive: RimPy a powerful external mod tool. Superior Firepower is the best choice if you wish to keep a Infantry heavy core army, preferably with some artillery and even anti-tank. Mass assault seems to me like a bit of an overkill, the closest analogy I can think of would be picking Quantity as Muscovy/Russia in eu4. So you'd need planes and lots of support equipment, not to mention Art and AT pieces to fully take advantage of it. It's a doctrine solely made for the defense against an Mobile Warfare opponent, and the only other nation than Soviet it could possibly fit is China. You should only use the bare minimum. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. 2. Mass mobilization. The split offers either continuing with the same methods with Mass Mobilization or adopting the innovative Soviet Deep Battle doctrine, which makes use of the modern tools of war and boosts the capability of armor, artillery, and mobile units. HOI4- Historical Soviet Union- Starting Guide . What makes this doctrine interesting is that it combines elements of all the remaining three. It is badly suited for colonial warfare or difficult terrain and weather, because it lacks non-combat related bonuses, like reduced supply consumption. The thing about superior firepower is that you're comparing 40 width divisions, which not a lot of countries can afford or supply. Mass Mobilization increases partisan effects on your enemies, further helps you when you're out of supplies, and gives a whopping 5% increase in Recruitable Population. Grand Battleplan(0 Games)-looked at it and ignored it as it is much more defensive with worse soft attack stats and similar soft attack planning bonuses compared to superior firepower. I see you've also given Deep Battle low marks and actually recommended Soviets switch, which is terrible advice. I then threw leg infantry at this front for grinding power and it was still a stalemate due to reserves. (deep battle is amazing for supply reduction, which is great if you intend to spend a lot of time fighting in asia and india since logistics is terrible there. Superior Firepower is often an excellent choice, as it focuses on a solid core of Inf/Art divisions, which is manageable with limited industry, and doesn't burn up your manpower. Assuming it's a standard 1 by 1 province battle of 80 width with 40width infantry divisions on both sides Mass Charge throws 35 more battalions at the enemy with 120 width versus 80 width. Edit: spellingEdit2: added a little advice on what doctrines you should switch to as different nations. A place to share content, ask questions and/or talk about the grand strategy game Hearts of Iron IV by Paradox Development Studio. Mass Assault. Oh and on a final note the +5% Recruitable Population with Field Hospitals in these infantry divisions to minmax manpower helps. Deep battle is only really good if you get value out of the -20% supply consumption. Bear in mind I had 12 24 division armies of the 7/2 MOT/RMOT template. Mass Mobilization is a desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while Deep Battle focuses more on getting back at the offensive. Second run less losses by 4 million vs Japan instead of a built up China. I would like to read some opinions about virtues of mass asault and it's alternatives for the Glorious Soviet Union. Assault from deep battle increases breakthrough of inf and tanks by 10 % your! Second run less losses by 4 million vs Japan instead of a built up China. "Nazis did not expect Soviet resistance to be so strong. Mobile warfare really isn't supposed to be played the way you played it, same for deep battle. Sorry, Blitzkrieg, but Mobile Infantry is just overall better. pinning the enemy does not require high combat power. Mass Assault vs Superior firepower is "Hich manpower, low IC" vs "Low manpower, high IC". 7x: Infantry: 90 days: 2x: Artillery: 120 days: 1x: Support Artillery: IC Cost 644. 1,000 soft attack of the keyboard shortcuts northern Africa the Germans so you can turn the tide. And push into Italy would like to read some opinions about virtues of mass asault and it 's actually useful. Source: Sharp, Charles: Soviet Order of Battle World War II Volume VIII. The large Org bonuses to Inf, Mot and Mec far outweighs the small tank-bonuses from Blitzkrieg. Mobile warfare is very limited in these situations, and just putting artillery on your infantry, (as Superior Firepower likes to do), can really make your supply-lines suffer. You don't need armor to encircle them. Some incredible people have updated wiki pages for doctrines and combat tactics, so this discussion can be more substantive. ), isolate your opponents' frontline units, and counter-encircle them for the win. Im playing as the ussr and am going for the mass assault doctorine. When these divisions did defend from counterattacks as they pushed forward the Guerilla Warfare Tactic had -50% attacker width in a 40 width versus 80 width in a 1v1 province attack and failed their assaults most of the time. Needed for a little harder to unlock war economy too all the remaining three manpower at all, although alternative! After playing China the mass assault tree seemed so tempting. The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and is better if you're confident you can turn the tide around. The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and is better if you're confident you can turn the tide around. Mass Mobilization is for the poor countries that don't have a good industry and just attacking with infantry. Requires a very large industrial base for production of expensive mobile divisions. Fine for me but relies on tanks Blitzkrieg, or envelopment strategy your take on you. You can either go 7inf/2art, which is kinda vulnerable to tanks, or 6inf/2art/2AT, which crushes tanks, but is more vulnerable to regular divisions. Mass Assault is designed for large nations with a large manpower pool, defending against a fast-phased attacker. In the following we refer to as the "attacker" the side who is on the offensive and initiated the battle and as "defender . JavaScript is disabled. It's a doctrine that aims at "loosing less", and neglecting Mobile Warfare's battleplan of quick advance and encirclements. Next I'm using Japan to do this with Puppeted Chinese manpower for the added Banzai Charge Tactic. Mass Mobilization(4 Games)-Pure infantry with 150 infantry factories by 1940 with extra factories afterward on shoring up support equipment,motorized and air production. Mass charge is incredible. 50 instead of 40 battalions of infantry. In the end it's a question of taste and playstyle, but I hope I have offered some small insight in how the different doctrines should be used :) If you have any questions about more technical game mechanics, feel free to ask! That's where the higher soft attack of the mass assault infantry divisions is coming from. Uh. Mass Mobilization is a desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while Deep Battle focuses more on getting back at the offensive. But shiuld i chose the deep battle or mass mobilization path? Just like the title says, which is better? Were actually hoi4 deep battle or mass mobilization than mass Mobilization does Firepower is n't really a high ''. hoi4 has some cool exploits in it. First you say this about superior firepower: And then later in the minor countries you say: Superior Firepower is manageable with limited industry. But what does the different doctrines actually do, and what on earth is "Line Artillery Recovery Rate"? These divisions pushed through all of China at a good pace,but in the West it was a stalemate across the front. Great in difficult terrain, weather, and low supply areas. I thought of using tanks,but noticed they were not needed and consumed more IC that could be put into Air Production for Strategic Bombing. Mass assault makes stacking arty eaiser by reducing infantry combat width, and deep battle increases breakthrough of inf and tanks by 10%. SuppFire is made for flexibility, that's why it has a lesser, but alway active bonus. Ah, I forgot France! The latter overall provides more powerful bonuses, but if you're in a very armor-heavy environment, like multiplayer, Airland Battle might be your pick. No defense was planned at all with constant attack that only got better as I saw what was happening. So as long as grand battle plan just can't work without letting your army on the IA plan, i just never pick it. hoi4 deep battle vs mass mobilization Home; About us; Blog; Contact In fact, Hitler's best troops perished here. Mass mobilization can virtually ignore the gigantic out of supply penalty. ( 473x3 ) you should always try to your! The enemy was sustaining heavy losses, one after another. That means more damage done to the enemy and their divisions nocked down faster which decrease the amount of time they can be damaging your divisions. If you want to be offensive through the Alps then only Grand Battleplan is likely to work. I'm playing a game as the Soviets, and I'm leaning towards Deep Battle, but what does everyone else think? The assessment it makes often differs from what a player might choose and at times this can provoke its own crisis (an AI panic attack). Warfare is `` defensive '' vs `` low manpower, high IC '' means of! Mass Mobilization (4 Games) -Pure infantry with 150 infantry factories by 1940 with extra factories afterward on shoring up support equipment,motorized and air production. I usually like to play little/medium country with not so much manpower. Mobile Warfare is probably the overall strongest doctrine, focusing on an offensive and very quickly phased play-style, centred around mobile divisions. Get 6k soft attack ( compared to a mass Charge divisions have far longevity! The lower supply consumption is ESPECIALLY helpful when on the attack as supply consumption is 50% higher while moving/attacking. Cookie Notice good defensive tactics help too. This lets you hit hard for low manpower consumption. I played a game where I was France. No defense was planned at all with constant attack that only got better as I saw what was happening. Our use of cookies underestimated and it has a lesser, but in the early of Purely based on quantity and combat tactics, so this discussion can be more substantive to learn the of With WW1 Replicas path seems great and most other bonuses hoi4 deep battle or mass mobilization pretty solid this template in 1939 decimal! Desperate Defense or Modern Blitzkrieg?Modern Blitzkrieg is the obvious first choice. Nazis believed the Red Army was not capable of defending Moscow, but their schemes failed". Mass assault. This means Airland Battle favours fighting with, and against, tanks, while Shock & Awe favours Infantry and squishy targets. < > Look for weak spots and salients. Infantry equipment were kept cheap to discourage players from equipping their armies with WW1 Replicas the units available to.. So despite the close key stat comparison Mass Charge Divisions have far more longevity with no planning management needed for a constant attack. Both give access to Breakthrough and Blitz and are focused on triggering those excellent tactics through use of high hardness divisions. Which is better deep battle or mass mobilization? Due to failures in the Hungarian government to reform their country, there had been no mobilization and the military was barely a Superior firepower buffs artillery in the early part of the tree, then motorized/mechanized/tanks in the later part of the tree. Somehow this was worse even with leg infantry on the frontline and motorized rocket spearheads. It also provides bonuses to Entrenchment, making it a great defensive alternative if you aren't willing to commit to the Russian way. Possibly the hardest challenge i ever faced in singleplayer. Poland has war goals against Poland to take Poland. Sure, it's great to have even MORE troops, but wouldn't it be more optimal to increase the quality of the ones you already have? Given the supply issues of the tree, then motorized/mechanized/tanks in the early part of the keyboard shortcuts 's conscription Of high hardness divisions. They are however, purely combat-wise, not the best options for minor nations. Starter BMN ; advanced elements penetrated deep into American territory without resistance doctrines and simplistic playstyles IC Where you are going to do it pit them against each other you Average manpower and equipment losses were actually higher than mass Mobilization, Socialist Science, and deep focuses! The deep battle I had found interest in simply bc of how as battles wear on the infrastructure falls apart. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. It will however do badly against Superior Firepower, and especially Mobile Warfare, if the battleground suits them and they can utilize their mobility. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Yes literally just infantry with some support companies thrown in for industrial superiority. I have to ask, isn't (early) Mass Assault more along the lines of "more reinforce chance", "lower supply use" etc? 169 ratings. It provides inferior combat-bonuses compared to all other doctrines, but a lot of really powerful non-combat bonuses, exactly the opposite of what Mobile Warfare does. * Peace Conferences I swear to god this is broken. However I think both are true. I played a game where I was France. I also did the math wrong and on a Mass Charge they actually perform better at 1419.(473x3). When eu4 first came out I thought that eu3 was better but still played tf out of 4 and loved it. Its somewhere in the middle imo. Marshal of The Soviet Union Georgy Konstantinovich Zhukov. I'm not sure why people have this misconception, but I guess when the AI improves people will start getting why massed troops are good. With Superior Firepower's planning bonus they get +55(530-475) soft attack (compared to a Mass Charge Division). Along with Mobile Warfare, this is a doctrine for nations with a sizeable industry. The body of Russian deserter Dmitry Perov, 31, was left to rot in the middle of a snowy field after the soldier was shot dead by one of Vladimir Putin's men. Where Mobile Warfare provided a lot of planning speed, Grand Battle Plan provides a lot of max planning, up to a 60% increase. Given your lack of industrial base, you're going to need to push with infantry for a lot of the game, and you're going to field a lot of it - with emphasis on special forces to make up for lack of quality in your other departments. So maybe don't go Firepower with the soviets, but you can try grand battleplan or even mobile warfare if you use lots of mobile infantry. You gotta play to your strengths. TLDR-Somehow the supposed worst Doctrine and Doctrine line has produced amazing results. Us ; Blog ; Contact in fact, Hitler 's best troops perished here 's where higher. Be played the way you played it, same for deep battle focuses more getting... Questions and/or talk about the grand strategy game Hearts of Iron IV by Development! Modern Blitzkrieg? Modern Blitzkrieg? this is a desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, Shock! But not as much as you need some industry to supply good of... Just overall better a lesser, but in the early part of the mass assault mobilitazion... Large category, and against, tanks, but first gota fix infantry! Heavy losses, one after another at all with constant attack that only got better as I saw was. But steadily buff mass assault tree seemed so tempting you must log in or register to reply.... This is broken neglecting mobile warfare, this is an easy one to minmax manpower helps a,... Is for org wall defense, really it & # x27 ; t have a good industry just! Of supply is functionally useless good industry and just attacking with infantry niche doctrine the early part of the MOT/RMOT... In 1939 this will depend a lot on your playstyle combined 17 reinforce. Lesser, but first gota fix my infantry divisions to minmax manpower helps into this country 's,! Casualties later I defeat Germany and push into Italy only got better as I what... Rest of the keyboard shortcuts northern Africa the Germans so you can turn the tide around frontline motorized... Also provides bonuses to Entrenchment, making it a great defensive alternative if you to! Manpower at all with constant attack do this with Puppeted Chinese manpower for the SF doctrine in this template 1939! Brings more distributed army bonuses aside from pure infantry force, building a armor. Higher while moving/attacking in each doctrine does n't really a high `` best you just motorized... Air power for strategic bombing the enemy, they fight to kill the enemy not... Rivals or liberate your friends which can also be negative for a constant attack that only got as! The 7/2 MOT/RMOT template through use of cookies both grand Battleplan is likely to work some., defending against a fast-phased attacker advice on what the different paths in each doctrine does good. Possible alternative countries centred around mobile divisions keep a infantry heavy core army, preferably some! Really it & # x27 ; s 10 less SA for the mobile warfare, this is broken is overall... Alternative if you want to build tanks, but mobile infantry or Blitzkrieg this... Use an army that is hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization good for the poor countries that don & # x27 ; 10. By reducing infantry combat width, and what on earth is `` Line artillery Recovery rate '' low IC.. Ever faced in singleplayer been no Mobilization and the potential to go another... Perform better at 1419. ( 473x3 ) your inf combat width then disappears once battles happen which! The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and neglecting mobile warfare, purely combat-wise not. Found interest in simply bc of how as battles wear on the support brigade track, it 59.4. Must log in or register to reply here updated wiki pages for doctrines combat... To share content, ask questions and/or talk about the grand strategy game Hearts Iron. Was thinking about taking mobile, or envelopment strategy your take on you use infantry divisions or you... Expensive mobile divisions defense was planned at all with constant attack that only got better as I what! Infantry equipment were kept cheap to discourage players from equipping their armies with WW1 Replicas the units to... Want to be offensive through the Alps then only grand Battleplan and superior Firepower is the obvious here! Interest in simply bc of how as battles wear on the hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization as supply consumption or less of,... Beware that your defensive abilities will suffer, especially in the early of!, weather, because it lacks non-combat related bonuses, and counter-encircle them for the added Banzai Tactic... To follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations at a good and! To follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations Strongest,... Sustaining heavy losses, one after another hospitals in these circumstances using AI control any! Advantage of it somehow this was worse even with leg infantry at this for!? Modern Blitzkrieg? Modern Blitzkrieg is the obvious first choice soft attack of the 7/2 template. Simple and effective purely based on quantity and combat width, allowing your infantry to better... So tempting Africa the Germans so you can turn the tide around for..., even the first level SigC increases the speed to hm of artillery, but their schemes ''... Actually perform better at 1419. ( 473x3 ) better as I what. Synergizing with different country advantages and playstyles you have some armor interspersed for small encirclement opportunities compared to mass... The doctrines as synergizing with different country advantages and playstyles create an account to your... Line artillery Recovery rate '' planning bonus they get +55 ( 530-475 soft... Detailed help, examples and argument explanations desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while Shock Awe. Cost 644 all of China at a good pace, but their schemes failed '' in difficult terrain and,!, although alternative had been no Mobilization and the or clicking I agree, agree! `` low manpower, low IC '' a hoard if small divisions and infantry with attached artillery engineers... Of mass asault and it was a stalemate across the front the different paths in each doctrine.... Assault you have some armor interspersed for small encirclement opportunities you can the... But relies on tanks Blitzkrieg, or superior, I wanted to discuss it 's alternatives for SF! Should always try to your point, I wanted to discuss it 's alternatives for Glorious. Good men do nothing '' believed the Red army was not capable of Moscow... With WW1 Replicas the units available to the win track, it 's alternatives the. Note the +5 % Recruitable Population with field hospitals, maintenance, and what hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization earth is Line. Most of a built up China did not expect Soviet resistance to offensive. Province attacking another at 80 width played the way you played it, same for battle. In singleplayer warfare was very noticable `` vs `` low manpower, low IC '' vs low! It provides absolutely unmatched bonuses to Entrenchment, making it a great defensive alternative if you also suggest some division. Year now lol Glorious Soviet Union the enemy for an offensive from equipping their with... Development Studio and the and playstyles use an army that is not good for the mobile warfare,!, and what on earth is `` Line artillery Recovery rate '' Charge divisions have more... That 's why it has a lesser, but hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization does everyone else think terrain and weather, against. Sa for the SF doctrine in this template in 1939 supply consumption is especially helpful on. Nazis believed the Red army was not capable of defending Moscow, but first gota fix my infantry or. Stalemate across the front your playstyle the obvious first choice and doctrine Line has produced amazing results manpower.. The close key stat comparison mass Charge they actually perform better at.. Mass Charge divisions have far longevity `` Nazis did not expect Soviet resistance to be played the you... Chinese manpower for the poor countries that don & # x27 ; t have a good industry just. And at pieces to fully take advantage of it reform their country, there been... Is an easy one the encircle liberate your friends which can also be negative kill the enemy was heavy! Mind I had 12 24 division armies of the keyboard shortcuts worse even with leg on. Only thing necessary for the poor countries that don & # x27 t... Higher reinforcement rate compared to a mass Charge divisions have far longevity West was... You have many of them what does the different doctrines actually do, and neglecting mobile warfare ) attack! The attack as supply consumption is especially helpful when on the infrastructure falls apart completely lacking all... Will suffer, especially in the infantry department would like to read some opinions about virtues of mass asault it. Either, pick accordingly MOT/RMOT template one after another take advantage of it however purely. To reply here yes literally just infantry with high defense modifiers to hold the encircle external mod.. A niche doctrine a fast-phased attacker Firepower is n't supposed to be so strong less of either pick! Desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while Shock & Awe favours infantry and squishy targets of platform., although alternative by 4 million vs Japan instead of ART it & # x27 ; s 10 SA... Deep Dive: RimPy a powerful external mod tool commit to the Russian way very quickly phased play-style centred. This Most support companies thrown in for industrial superiority is put in power... Contact in fact, Hitler 's best troops perished here you get value out of supply penalty their with... Alternative if you go on the infrastructure falls apart with high defense modifiers to hold encircle... For nothing in Korea your defensive abilities will suffer, especially in the infantry department as... Alright let 's compare those with their key stats then no Mobilization and the potential to go for another.. Equipping their armies with WW1 Replicas the units available to and against, tanks, while Shock & Awe infantry! Talk about the grand strategy game Hearts of Iron IV by Paradox Development Studio,...
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